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Post by Sergei Arkadyevich Ourumov on Nov 26, 2016 0:03:57 GMT
"The major difference in scorched earth policies of the past was avoiding what could have been potential strongholds and targets at all costs due to them being civilian in nature. However, we do not possess that luxury in fighting an enemy that hides among the civilians and uses them for military gains. Vietnam, with high explosives from B-52s and 'Agent Orange,' were mainly meant to reveal guerrillas by destroying forestry and areas that could have potentially hidden someone. This is markedly different because we are potentially targeting not only the areas the GLA can hide, but areas we know for a fact the GLA will hide in: civilian population centres." At this, the crowds began murmuring, looking to the Russian delegation with awe and nervousness. "I understand that it is a difficult thing to realize, but the United Nations already voted: Terra Nullius is already unfit for a legitimate government, and sooner or later, the GLA will attack another civilization. Who is to say that it won't be Europe again? Or the United States? Or South America? Or even Russia?" Sergei then cleared his throat, awaiting more questions from the delegations, hopefully not another from the AEDP.
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Post by Archibald Stanford on Nov 26, 2016 0:37:29 GMT
"So, you're suggesting that due to a place being designated an area that isn't capable of supporting a government. We should therefore strip them of the rights under the laws of war that they are entitled to?" He questioned forcefully. "Are you suggesting that The U.N has declared anyone who resides in the zone is not protected by Articles 51 and 54 of Protocol 1 of The Geneva Convention? Along with the ability for you to ignore Article 35 of the same protocol that protects civilians from enduring methods of warfare that cause lasting damage to the environment?"
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Post by Dmitry Molchanov on Nov 26, 2016 1:10:27 GMT
"Well, yes," Sergei stated, resulting in several gasps across the board, "But hold on. Does the GLA apply any of the rules of warfare to their crimes? Do they—" Dmitry had seen and heard enough. As he stood up and moved to the podium, several members of CSTO-alligned states came to hold him back. Stay out of my way if you know what is good for you!" Dmitry growled to one of them, who backed off as Dmitry pushed Sergei aside. "Alright, I have had about enough of this Archie! Let me ask you loud and clear, what gives you the right to speak of military law, when you clearly flout it yourselves?! Not one, but TWO private military organization that abide by no government, and are paid by the highest bidder to 'protect' them! Let me tell you, I don't think you understand what's going on here. You are dealing with an enemy who will fight with no remorse or mercy for civilians, and use them as political and military shields as my chief of staff has stated!" Dmitry then stepped off the podium and got up close and personal with the Supreme Commander, clearly angered by his attempts to try and rationalize any other way out of this. "I am sick and tired of you trying to play the part of the 'sensible' leader of Europe, when it is clear that you would prefer more attacks from the GLA over actually doing something about them like I am! Does anyone remember Hamburg? 10 megaton nuclear weapon? Why didn't Europe defend itself? Why did it ask others to do its own work? Was it too weak to do it itself? Or does it prefer playing the victim card? Three major attacks afterwards: the Rhine, the bombing in Brussels, and now Venice! Where were you when the GLA poisoned the Rhine? Where were you when Brussels was bombed? Are you secretly hoping they will stay a little longer? Are they hiding behind the people of Europe again?!" Dmitry now leered over the European delegation, but before he could say anything further, General Ourumov pulled the man back and set him in his chair. "YA dumal, chto ya skazal vam, chtoby pozvolit' mne sdelat' razgovor! U menya bylo eto pod kontrolem! Pri vsem uvazhenii, Gospodin Predsedatel', sadis' i zatknis'! " Dmitry looked to Ourumov with fury before taking a deep breath and slacking back in his seat, looking aggressively to the commander. Ourumov then turned to Andrey and sighed. "Ubedites' v tom, chto on ne vstayet so svoyego mesta snova. [Make sure he does not get up from his seat again.]" He then walked back to the podium, clearing his breath before continuing. "Yes. I am suggesting we deprive the people in Africa of their rights in the rules of war for the betterment of mankind. It's obvious the GLA will continue to hide behind military and political shields like civilians for as long as they exist, and similar organizations, such as Al-Qaeda and ISIS, were never truly strong enough to make it work. As for the articles of the Geneva conventions, I do understand that what we are suggesting would be breaking international law on multiple scales, but the GLA has done worse on many more levels." Ourumov then smiled and cleared his throat again, "However, I believe it is our turn to ask a question, this time more civilly than President Molchanov. What is your suggestion to deal with the threat that is the GLA as quickly and quietly as possible? I'm sure a man of your talents must have something you can disclose about dealing with them. After all, we just disclosed a plan to essentially burn Terra Nullius to smoke them out."
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Post by Archibald Stanford on Nov 26, 2016 1:59:12 GMT
Archibald watched Dmitry explode in fury quietly. After a few moments of silence had passed after the Russian President was restrained and placed back in his seat, he provided an answer.
"President Molchanov," He began solemnly. "I have absolutely nothing to say regarding Hamburg and The Rhine since the organisation I lead at this moment did not exist, and I say it is most unfair of you to try and place that tragedy at my doorstep when I wasn't in a position to make an impact. I have already stated that the bombing of Brussels was a plot that slipped through the net during the transition between the defunct European Continental Alliance and The AEDP. As for Venice, we may not have detected it, but we were most certainly able to prevent what was clearly going to be a catastrophe."
Archibald spun his teacup round its saucer once and took a sip before continuing.
"You are a man who is most certainly concerned about the safety of his fellow human, regardless of their nationality, however that does not give you the right to ignore the rules we, as decent human beings, are obliged to follow. As for your rather angry accusation of the alleged legal freedom my organisation possesses, you would be completely incorrect in believing such an idea. I have done my studying and I can confidently say that I have no legal protection by not being affiliated directly with a nation. I, and anyone else within The AEDP, is liable to be arrested, tried and punished for the commission of war crimes. There are a number of rules of warfare that we are all obliged to uphold, even if we've never given consent or formally pledged our obedience to them. So, no, I'm not in a position to flout the rules that everyone else is required to abide by and neither are you, sir. I will freely admit that optional conventions such as those regarding land mines and such I am well within my rights to refuse to be party to them, but there are some that I am obliged to follow."
After finishing his rebuttal to Molchanov, he turned towards Ourumov.
"There is no suggestion on this earth that can eliminate The GLA as a threat quickly, General. Their structure is unique in that it unites people with conflicting beliefs, desires and aims. As such, they are not your standard political movement that we are all aware of from the past. History has shown that a revolutionary organisation based on one goal can crumble into the pages of memory simply by satisfying that goal preemptively. Such a method is impossible when The GLA provides a platform for a vast variety of grievances to be vented into one mighty force."
Archibald looked down at his teacup and began to spin it as he continued his statement in an almost contemplative manner.
"No... The Russian plan will fail. The GLA will come back stronger than ever, recruiting those who have been forced to endure the holocaust of destruction that you suggest is the solution. Their ranks will swell with the desire for revenge against Russia, imperilling the lives of hundreds of Russians. A plan far more ambitious than just throwing explosives at the problem is required to begin to eat away at this menace. This war will last for years, some of the people at this table may no longer be in office by the time it meets with success, but we shall succeed."
After falling silent in a moment of thought, Archibald took a deep breath and looked up at the other delegates.
"So!" He said in a more upbeat and jovial tone. "You wished to know if I had a plan to disclose to the people present, Marshal Ourumov. My answer is tha-"
Archibald is suddenly cut off by the sound of a cell phone ringing. His subordinate, General Billotte, retrieves the device and answers it in French. After a few brief sentences enquiring who is calling, he leans over and whispers into Archibald's ear. Nodding, Archie stands up and takes the phone.
"Ladies and gentlemen, I apologise for the interruption, but I have an important call. If you'll excuse me, I and General Billotte need to take this call in private."
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Post by Sergei Arkadyevich Ourumov on Nov 26, 2016 2:43:03 GMT
As Sergei watched the man leave the room to discuss in private, the general turned to the other delegates. "Do you have any other questions then?"
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Post by Andrey Voronov on Nov 26, 2016 3:31:10 GMT
Voronov stood up once Archibald left the room. A few seconds too late, he thought. Nevertheless, he began.
"Perhaps, Sergei, we could begin a total war against the GLA they have been waging against us for years. A total war versus an enemy that has total contempt for our civilized ways, is total in it's goals, and it's methods. Ideally, we could constrict them like a boa. No doubt, when they hear the sounds of rockets screaming over the jungle, it will shake them. There is to be no stop... A joint alliance against terror can cut off GLA access from the seaways, landlocking them and subjecting them to the largest siege in terms of landmass the world has ever seen! Mozambique - a joint Russian-NAU endeavor. Gabon, a Chinese-European force from the north to link up while a NAU assault does the same from the south. Then, we squeeze. Little by little, chop them up. It will be expensive militarily, yes... But it is not obliteration of all of Africa." Voronov shook his head at his previous thought of giving his oath. Perhaps it was a bad idea? There was little choice.. or was there? In his mind, as he sat down and took another sip of his drink, he battled it out in his mind of what to do, of whether he should rescind his oath or not. The death of millions...
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Post by Mendoza Chávez De La Hoya Card on Nov 26, 2016 20:48:59 GMT
Mendoza ordered a fine cuo of coffee from colombian beans. While enjoying this hot drink he listenend from the left of the room to the right. Murmeling something to his assistent, who nodded, and refocussing to this conversation. After Archibald left the room while the Russians still were busy talking, Mendoza witnessed how a representative from the Bangladore Pact stood up and walked over to some guest microphone. He recognized this man as he was the chairman of the Bangladore Pact, Mr. Punjabi.
"So you mighty Russians really think that the use and deployment of WMDs and other heavy weapons is truly the answer? To fight the GLA? After a single helicopter accidently crashed in your territory? While knowing that the Russian Convoy moved outside their own, and rather choose a risky shortcut near GLA activities? An all out war against your client? Is this truly your enemy or just a away to clean up Russia's questionable past?" The chairman started and took some heavy breaths, awaiting Russian countee replies.
(OOC Since I didn't received an answer on skype, made me do this eventually. Taking the liberty of feeling that this can be fun)
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Post by Dmitry Molchanov on Nov 27, 2016 21:35:43 GMT
Dmitry, despite being told to sit down, was not about to take accusations from another group of nations who had no evidence or proof to back their claim. "I've had enough!" he barked, sitting closer to his microphone. "What evidence do you have that backs the statement of the Russian Federation still backing the Global Liberation Army? What right do you have to assume that we, after purging our government of the corrupt oligarchs, still have connections with them? The same could be said about your pact, the United States, the AEDP, or anyone, and you still wouldn't have the proof to back it up. If you want a comprehensive statement on arms deals between the Russian Federation and its clients, I will be more than happy to provide you with the full list, and you will notice that, in the past 20 years, there have been NO weapons trades between Russia and countries that make up Terra Nullius! Furthermore, what exactly are YOU doing to put an end to the GLA? What have you contributed? Oh wait, that's right; you harbored GLA rebels during the Global War on Terror before China came in!" The room nearly collectively gasped and began murmuring, with General Ourumov pinching the bridge of his nose in annoyance and in shame at his President's display. Dmitry was a good man, but his hotheadedness would make him seem more like the enemy than the GLA were. "What's more, is that I am tired of having the Russian Federation being bullied and pushed down because of a mistake that was discovered years ago. It is no different than after the Cold War, and it is still a problem that I believe that you all should address! I try to do right, and try to make amends for the past failures of the Russian Federation, and you STILL belittle and berate us for even considering doing ANYTHING! I will not stand for it anymore! I am putting my foot down!" Dmitry then stood up, fuming at the crowd before him. However, before he could do anything more, U.N. security walked in and started walking him out, on request of General Ourumov. The general then looked to the delegations of the U.N. before sighing. "Any further questions, and this time NOT connected to our questionable actions in the past? Right now, we need to concentrate on the present, and this stratagem is what is needing to be concentrated on."
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Post by Mendoza Chávez De La Hoya Card on Nov 28, 2016 19:18:25 GMT
Mendoza burried his face in both his hands. While slowly whiping thrm across it, one of his hands kept his chin up while the other just grabbed once more his cup of coffee. Dmitry... he thoight but were woken up from his thoughts as Punjabi once more claimed word.
While waving with his index finger (no no no) he continued "Is this the man who we need to believe? Its quite easy to claim not to trade to and within Terra Nulius. But are we stupid? I think not... when a country will suffer under an embargo, and its forbidden to be suplied, the supliers will find other ways with countries who' s hands aren't tied up. Or did the Russians forget their partner Turkey? A shortcut to deny embargo's..." Punjabi easily countered the Russian Presidents explenation.
"Did we forget the Nazi's? How long did Germany worked to make up for that dark area on humanities history? And this Russian President want to do it easily over on a bigger scale! Look, a Nuclear Weapon once a while is still.... thinkable. Eeh... imaginable" Punjabi corrected himself. "But to go all in? Tsk tsk. This man is more dangerous then a kid with a matchstick in a gunpowder factory. I mean.. look at how he reacts in a civil discussion.." multiple representativrs nodded in Punjabi's favour and a slight rumour occured in how the spectators think about both Dmitry's and Punjabi's words.
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Post by Andrey Voronov on Dec 2, 2016 1:14:16 GMT
Voronov stood up in turn, while Russian delegates murmured to his side. Angrily and forcefully, he began to speak, sharply exhaling and staring the Bangalore delegates straight in the eyes with an uncompromising stare.
"So you think that you can simply criticize, while not even having been touched by the GLA and not aiding to the African wars against the subversives of the GLA? Tsk tsk, I thought you a better man, than to 'backseat drive', as they say, this war effort. Apparently, you should read a history book or even watch some news every now and then because all of the people responsible for the realpolitik arms trade with the GLA are dead, in prison, or in exile..." Voronov, unlike Molchanov, kept his head high. "And how do we know you aren't aiding the GLA yourselves? Where were you when Iranian oilfields were seized, a scud barrage was launched at Baghdad, and Baikonur was under assault? Where were the constituent nations of the Bangalore Pact when a missile was launched at both Israel and Norway?!" Voronov took a few seconds while the room was collecting their thoughts under this accusation. "It's clear that you don't know anything about the 'Russian revolution', as I call it, of 2028. The corrupt president was killed and drew his last breath fighting against crowds who supported liberty, equality, and integrity." Voronov shot a look at Ourumov, substantially pleased that Voronov was taking the Bangalore Pact with calm demeanor and not the near-rage of Molchanov. I should've still been President, he thought to himself... Molchanov could be occasionally referred to as an embarrassment.
"If we are talking about questionable pasts, then, Mr. Punjabi, should you be really talking? You have no right to judge, especially since your nation still does not contribute any significant amount of aid to defeating global terrorism. While I do not condone nuclear weaponry at all, the GLA is an enemy that is merciless. Hamburg, the Rhine, Tel Aviv... These memories still linger in the minds of many people. And you are saying we should stand by and do nothing, and watch as the GLA gather their strength? As Suvorov said... it is better to end it now with many deaths in a short time, than drag it on with massive deaths in a long time." Voronov took his seat and awaited the Bangalore response.
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Post by Sergei Arkadyevich Ourumov on Dec 2, 2016 2:15:56 GMT
"Alright, let me be clear here when I state that the use of nuclear weapons is going to only be a last resort or retaliatory strike for the Russian Federation and this stratagem in particular," General Ourumov spoke up over the murmur, leading to a quiet around the conference hall. Sergei had enough of polticians being politicians for one day, and decided to lay down the simplicity of what Russia was going to achieve. "Russia's policy has never been, nor will it ever be a 'nuclear first' policy. Our primary goal with this stratagem is to cripple the GLA, round up surviving civilians, give them the aid and treatment that they would need afterwards, and rebuild the region after the conflict." General Ourumov then took a sip of the vodka he had and cleared his throat before continuing. "The GLA is a much greater threat than any of you have anticipated. The only other region of the world that seems to know the threat of the GLA is China, who has officially declared war on them yet again. Now, the implementation of this plan is, yes, highly controversial, and the possibility of breaking the active rules of warfare is almost certain, but have we not already done so before? The Global War on Terror in the second decade: the People's Liberation Army enacted a similar, if not more brutal and indiscriminate scorched earth policy against the GLA back in the early stages of the war, and the use of nuclear weapons, both within and out of civilian areas, was incredibly liberal; the use of such a controversial stratagem, however, was considered a military necessity, due to GLA forces occupying territories that would, under normal circumstance, not be targeted." Murmuring from the other delegations rose, and Sergei rose his hand and harshly shushed them before continuing on. "If we look back to the ending stages of the Second World War, in 1945, the United States dropped the first atomic weapons on targets that were both military and civilian in nature due to military necessity, and we also see that the active rules of war could be seen as broken at that point in time. The major parties of both conflicts, however, assisted in humanitarian aid and efforts to save survivors, both civilian and militant in nature, and rebuild areas that were affected by the conflicts that they each participated in." Sergei then took of his hat and took another sip of vodka. "This is what I propose: after the scorched earth policy is put into full effect, a peacekeeping force, whether it is Russian, Chinese, North American, or even European, should assist in arresting and ostracizing remaining GLA supporters and terrorist cells in the region, while helping to rebuild and save survivors from the conflict. Afterwards, we may be able to partition portions of Terra Nullius to African governments in the Maghreb Union, African NAU and GAPA clients, and the East African Federation and assist in setting up legitimate governments. Afterwards, we can continue to hunt the GLA by less destructive means for." Ourumov then sighed and put back on his cap. "I am going to be perfectly honest. No matter which way we go about this, whether we want the GLA gone quickly or not, civilians are going to die. If we take the long path, the Global Liberation Army will continue to use civilians as political and military shields and continue to cause untold destruction and anarchy across varying groups. If we take the short path, yes: there will be a large number of civilian casualties, but at the very least, there won't be nearly as many in only a few short weeks as there have been in the past 30 years of the GLA's existence. Hundreds upon hundreds of millions have already died to the GLA, and it's clear that the GLA will refuse to stop its destructive ways. Appeasement is what brought Adolf Hitler and the Nazi Party back to power, and it has been what's brought the GLA and other radicals and extremists back to power." Sergei remained silent for a few moments before speaking once more. "To summarize: let's all work together to save as many lives as we can, rather than stay at each other's throats and bark incessantly like stupid, stupid dogs, and then move on once the Global Liberation Army is dealt with out of military necessity."
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Post by John Fitzgerald Kennedy II on Dec 2, 2016 17:02:50 GMT
"If you do intend to go through with this, I'll allow the use of NAU territories to evacuate the civilians and only for that purpose. If you want to bomb them you can do it from your own territories" Kennedy said leaning back in his chair and taking a sip of his green tea.
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Post by Sergei Arkadyevich Ourumov on Dec 2, 2016 17:05:24 GMT
Sergei immediately smiled at the NAU's willingness to go along with the stratagem. Now it was just a matter of convincing China and the Maghreb Union to do so as well. "Thank you for your cooperation, Gospodin Prezident. Your contributions to eradicating the GLA will be remembered."
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Post by Wang Xi Jintao on Dec 3, 2016 13:27:27 GMT
Wang Xi Jintao coughed to gain attention. After it became a little more silent to a level what was suitable for the Chinese leader, he stood up. “My honourable co-leaders, guests, members, UN-employees, and others. Thank you for your efforts thus far. Let it be known that China appreciates these kind of dialogues. Rather than see a united world, I simply must admit that the diversity is still high. Fair enough, there is enough reason for it!” Jintao said the last words with more power in his voice. “I only hear accusations and denying’s. From the left to the right of this magnificent room. But I must honourably ask how come it is that the Russian leaders decided to play such a dangerous and quick draw game over, just to prove a point? Whether you are right or not, is not the main issue right here. And yes I am talking to the majority of you honourable people…” Jintao said while looking towards multiple sides. “Russia… Mother Russia. Why are you so determined to go to a war, to rise the feelings that you make a race over this after China declared war? This is a very concerning question. You say to do the right thing. Well… No. Perhaps you are taking care of a questionable past. We all know it, and we cannot deny it. But China has fought this enemy countless times. And now, we will do it again. China will be generous!” Jintao said again with a stronger voice. Several of the Chinese people inside the room nodded firmly or applaud. “Russia, you are trying to take a leading role in a theatre what isn’t yours. I do not wish to get in a never ending discussion about if it is right or wrong. But you need to know your place! This is an insult to our prosperity, to our generosity… Our honour is at stake and you are trying to take it away. I honourably admit that we are not pleased with this. To surpass the might of China and its interests with this lack of communication dedicates the future of the Russian Federation. Going to a war with these words and this kind of behaviour doesn’t bring what you are trying to get. The lack of discipline of your president to control himself is highly concern able.” Jintao said while pointing to the door in which Dmitry has been escorted out by the guards. The audience raised their volume while rumouring and talking to each other to the words what came from Wang. Yet he refused to step down to let someone else take his place. Coughing a few times didn’t work, and it was Ta Hun Kwai who slammed with an empty glass a couple of times on the desk to calm everybody down. Wang took a deep breath. “Yes, years ago, weapons of mass destruction, weapons who are listed under the controversial list ‘Super Weapons’ and other weapons who can deliver damage to a large area who are not listed under either one, were used in the Global War against Terror. Most likely, and I give the Russians the benefit of the doubt, they will be used once more. The GLA started after all the war with using a nuclear bomb in Beijing. Various nuclear weapons, SCUDs and the famous Particle Cannon were deployed on a regular base. But perhaps the Russians need to recalculate the loses. Hundreds of millions dead is too high. Despite that the war was across Asia, Middle East, large parts of Africa and Europe, with these much dead’s, large areas would have been deserted. For a different comparison, if all who died in that war were a citizen of Europe, united or not, the continent would have nearly been extinct…” Jintao lifted his hand up to calm once more the people down. But it didn’t helped. Wang decided to retake his seat while looking still firmly in the room. His temper calmed a little, but it was still noticeable. Together with Kwai and 2 other officials, the men started talking about certain things. In the back of the UN room, the Chinese also started to talk while remaining in the dark. Their honour was at stake.
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Post by Dmitry Molchanov on Dec 3, 2016 19:10:02 GMT
"Premier Jintao, while I do understand that it may seem like we are taking the spotlight from you, I can assure you that we had or have any intention of doing so. As for your honor, forgive me for stating this, but this is more a matter of international security than a conflict based on honor. You are free to assist with evacuation and hunting down remaining GLA members, but if you have nothing to contribute, then please make sure you stay out of the crossfire. We wouldn't want a Russian bombardment on Chinese forces we didn't know were even there." Sergei then waited for the Premier's response, hoping that he would see betterment in cooperating with these efforts, rather than trying to make them seem moot. However, before a response could be made, Dmitry walked back in, this time smiling. It clearly wasn't a natural smile, but rather forced. It appeared that the President was keeping his anger under control, or at least attempting to, but any self-respecting diplomat in the room could tell from one look that President Molchanov's temper was still very high.
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